Is there anything personal between you and Asiwaju Tinubu?
Personal? Nothing. But as a Lagosian, I owe it a duty…
He is also a Lagosian
Ah. Give me a break. He said he is a Tinubu. But his brother, who is Chief of Staff to the governor in Osun, his younger brother, has a different name. The Tinubus that I know in Kakawa, he doesn’t even have a semblance of them. They are very tall and huge. That Baba, the Alfa. So, which Tinubu is this one? Where does he come from? He said he grew up, he went to Government College Ibadan (GCI). He mentioned the year, nobody knew him in their class. He said he went to Children’s Home School, Ibadan. That is also a lie. He said he has CPA (Chartered Public Accountant), it is a lie. Now, who is this man? I am even wondering whether he is a man, a boy, a girl or a woman. Everything he says is a lie. That is why I want to warn and advise those governors who are dancing round him. You know, Alhaji Atiku Abubakar is a very, very, very astute politician. That is how he deceived him. He (Atiku) went to him. He took a ‘440’ (lightening) dash out of his house. That this is a real monster. Ribadu too. It is the shame that can’t make Ribadu to come back. He did ‘Shege’ (‘hell’) to Ribadu. General Buhari, he is not a young man any more. I don’t want him to have a heart attack when he deals with this man. If he tells him good morning, I am sure it is very late in the night. Very dark, it can’t be morning. So, they have to be careful. Morning shows the day. They shouldn’t just because of ambition team up with him. I have nothing personal against him (Tinubu).
But you are sounding as if there is
I should have, because he arranged with Farida, the EFCC leadership and others to rail-road me to jail. What I am saying now, I have been saying long before that time, and I will continue until he purges himself and return all our properties in Lagos.
There is a widely held view that for peace to reign, President Goodluck Jonathan should not contest in 2015.
Why should he not contest? Which peace to reign? Look, it is Turn-by-Turn Nigeria Limited. You can say Constitution this, Constitution that. I am begging my brothers in our PDP, don’t destroy the house. As a Christian, I know that whoever God puts in position of authority, He is there. Pray for him, help him, so you can be at peace with yourself. Don’t rail-road him out of the Government House. Don’t pull him down, which is our own hallmark. Pray for him. This is our nation. Whoever would contest at that time, God has already positioned the person. Yes, it is normal, it is right for others to want to take a shot at it. But like I said, when we put the TOTALITY of this nation on the table, for peace to reign, it is Turn-by-Turn Nigeria Limited. It is a brilliant concept, Pa Awolowo suggested it in the 1954 Constitutional Conference, it is what has sustained democracy till now. What is four years in the life of a nation? Nothing. Nothing.
But most Northerners are opposed to Jonathan’s re-election
My best friend is a Fulani man. We have come a long way. He will remain my friend till I die because we met when we were nothing.
Who is that sir?
Admiral Nyako (Governor of Adamawa State). We met on board a ship. So, I want to plead with people. I am absolutely detribalised. I go to his house. His family is mine, mine is his. Whether I am there or not, he would defend me. So, all this raking up a lot of heat before the D-day, we should calm down. This nation has had only 14 years of existence in terms of democratic practice. It is still a teenager. If he says ‘Yes’, he still wants to do it, what is wrong with that? That would settle what Baba Awolowo suggested 40 years ago. When he said, some day in this country, an Ijaw man – and he was referring to the minorities – would become President of this country. Because, for a minority to rise up to that level, it means general acceptability that all of us are Nigerians and we are proud to be Nigerians. So, if you run him out, that he must go, he must go. It is not him alone. I know our people will say ‘they have not finished their term,’… we cannot sit down and control and conclude a perfect system. And there is no perfect system anywhere. But I am sure, by the time the leaders, the elders sit down, an amicable solution would be found. What is scary now is the posturing as if it is a matter of life and death. No. It is about service, isn’t it? We would come together, sit together. This side would marshal their points, the other side would marshal theirs. The leaders would look at it, and we would beg here, beg there, for the sake of the entity we call Nigeria. We just didn’t come together by chance. And our size is our strength. And there is no part of this nation that does not have something that they can give to share in this entity called Nigeria.
So, all those posturings that this is a matter of life and death, threatening to bring down the roof, bring down the house, saying it is ‘Tulasi’ ( a must), who would be there to enjoy it? We can’t be like Somalia. It is a failed state.
Some have said the party was too hard on Governors Amaechi and Wamakko
I am begging all sides, both the party, the governors, the NGF, to calm down. The crisis is not a fundamental one. There has been a little misunderstanding that is now getting bigger and bigger and bigger. Created by the opposition, trying to destabilise the PDP. They would try. And that is why I am advising those people, how can you leave the house you built, you suffered, you laboured to go and be a tenant? This is your house, you are a landlord here. You have benefitted from the house. You made your own contribution. Everybody enjoyed it. Some fellow is now inviting you to come and stay in his own house. They should think, and look back in history. It has never worked, and it would never work. An astute politician was deceived. He ran there, thinking he would be this, he would be that. What did he do to Atiku? Atiku later realised that this fellow is a fraudster, a joker. The most deceitful character ever established in Nigeria. He (Atiku) ran back, like a flying bullet. He dropped him like a hot potato, and ran back to the PDP. In the meantime, he had lost the steam. He is just trying to rebuild himself. If he never left PDP,… that is why, if you are a member of a family, don’t start going out to the market place to start fighting your family. Let us call a meeting, and I am happy because the President started a very beautiful concept. The family dinner. It has never happened. Where the founding fathers, the young ones, the new ones, the middle ones, everybody met. That is a family meeting. That kind of a meeting would resolve this crisis, because we would tell them this house would not be destroyed. This house would not be demolished. It is the only house in this country that has the full colours of Nigeria. From the swampy forest to the Savannah region. No other party. Even this APC they are talking about, what is their strength? They said they have leading Yoruba people there. Who is he? This one to lead Yoruba, we? To where? Let Jega make sure that the elections are conducted with the most modern system, and you would see who the Yoruba are. This one as their leader? Somebody asked me recently whether I want to be leader of Yoruba. Me ‘ke’ (Me?). How can I? At my age? There are fathers, there are our grandfathers, they are the leaders. I am just a contributor. And I would continue to make sure our people are not rubbished. That is why we are telling this joker. Leader of who? We are proud here with our education, with our culture, with our norms. We have respect for public order, respect for decency, respect to be God-fearing. He hasn’t got any trait of all that. His own is just to loot. Even if you come from a parentage that is so poor, why are you afraid to say it? ‘This is my mother’, Yes! All of us can’t be born with silver spoon. Why are you a perpetual, congenital liar? How can they trust you? You lied about your past, you lied about your school. You lied about your degree. You are lying in government, and you say people should trust you, how?
His mother died, he couldn’t go to the burial. Why? He chose Alhaja Mogaji here (who died after this interview was conducted) to say she is his mother. When did that one get pregnant to born him?… I don’t know, I don’t know.
Dr. Frederick Fasehun is making effort to resuscitate Chief Awolowo’s party (the UPN), so there is likely to be a third political force (in the South West) in 2015. Is the PDP ready for that kind of contest?
Like I told you, the Yoruba are the most politically-sophisticated people in this country. They are watching, they are staying back. We (in the PDP) should go back and re-organise ourselves, resolve the differences we have and calm down all personal ambitions amongst our own people. We don’t have an emperor like they do in the ACN. His wish is their command. They have no say in the party. It is his private company. That is not what we are doing. People are watching us. First of all, we trying now to re-establish that the party is supreme. The platform on which we want to launch must be a stable one. Because if it remains unstable, nobody can launch anything. We have learnt that lesson, and we are making corrections. About the other party, (who are claiming to be following the footsteps of Awolowo), what are the tenets of Awolowo? If we are to go and dust up documents, his programmes, his policies, his methodology in they are still as current today as they were in those days. It is still a good template you can give to any new man, and tell the person, ‘Go and implement, you would shine’… We have been tested. Now we are ready. All these bickerings, pettiness, jealousy, innuendos cannot lead us anywhere. And everybody has learnt that lesson now. That a tree cannot make a forest. So, if we get ourselves across all that and reposition ourselves before the people of this area, they would vote for us. But, let our votes be the genuine votes. Not what Tinubu would go and write. Because, there would be chaos here.
Why did you say that?
The last time, they cheated us here in Obalende-Ikoyi. They cheated us in council elections in the biggest local government in Lagos, Alimosho; they cheated us in Badagry. The people are now wiser… And when you ask, what is politics? It is the management of resources of a state for the betterment of the people. So, when you go to them and say, vote for me, you are saying to them, trust me, let me go and manage it on your behalf so that your standard of living can improve. That is all. Not to go and steal, and cheat, and convert all the assets into your pocket. That is not politics, that is politricks. The people have listened to them. By that time, it would be almost 16 years. Have they actually fulfilled or met the expectations of the people? No. And it is better shown in Lagos. Anytime they wanted to get there, they would go and organise and take care of our people. Not any more. God Almighty has heard our prayers. The people have seen the truth. Like the Lekki people, who when they went on demonstration, he mauled them down as if they are rats. Does he have the tolerance level to see himself as a politician? He sees himself as an emperor. The greatest dictator. He has no respect for democracy, he doesn’t even understand the definition of democracy. We had to be going down there to be bailing our people at Panti Police Station, at Yaba. He locked them up, decent civilised people. Locked them up in criminal cells. That is the man who called himself leader, leader of who? How many aircraft does he have?
Does he have an aircraft?
He has four. The latest he has is the type that can fly directly from Lagos to New York non-stop. That is a man who came to Lagos in Molue. From Iragbiji. What does General Johnson ride? Baba Jakande. These were the founding fathers, who managed the state. He ran the place, just eight years in government, and he has four private jets. He converted our shares in Econet and bought Oando. He has bought the Nurses hostel, he has bought this local government secretariat. Many many highrises in Ikoyi now are owned by Bola Tinubu? He converted the Lagos State Governor’s Guest House in Queen’s Drive to his personal house. The Oando house, where he is staying now on Bourdillon, he said they should buy it from Oando, they bought it from Oando, Lagos State now gave it to him as his parting gift.
The Government House in Abuja, the Lagos State Government House, the one in front of it now is his personal house. They have allocated it to him as his parting gift. Because he made a law. The people he put there (Lagos State House of Assembly) were not representatives of the people. They were his representatives. But there would be a day after. I am saying all these because some day, some people would say, when all these things were going on, what the heck did you people do? Some of us are bold enough to talk, others are cringing and pretending. But there would be a day after. We shall see.